When are we expecting news?

[Launchpad]

Yeah that was the unspoken reason I didn’t link, but you said the quiet part out loud. He was just the only person I’ve seen actually show any proof RPK made the statement.

And yeah, I said the same in the thread about the series. It’s most likely just a guess he can make some quick money off of and pretend he has credibility if it comes to pass. We haven’t seen anyone corroborate it yet, which makes me think that’s probably what is happening.

I mean, he could at least have the cahones to give a month, a season, or even am early/late estimate! This "2025" shit is weak. I feel nothing over it. If you want to rile people up give an exact date. Freak em out.

 

[Squood!]

Yeah that was the unspoken reason I didn’t link, but you said the quiet part out loud. He was just the only person I’ve seen actually show any proof RPK made the statement.

And yeah, I said the same in the thread about the series. It’s most likely just a guess he can make some quick money off of and pretend he has credibility if it comes to pass. We haven’t seen anyone corroborate it yet, which makes me think that’s probably what is happening.

Considerin' how I believe people who CAN leak things don't give a fuck about leaking KH stuff except the practically lucky mishaps and early copies of KH3 2018 I highly doubt we'll see anybody corroborate the claims. Which makes Nomura's statement that he revealed KH4 early to avoid leaks just seem like irrational worry cuz outside of the GeForce leak there were only two 4chan posts that claim to know the anniversary reveals and neither had ML or KH4 but instead "PS5 ports" and "III.5"

I highly believe it's more likely that a legit Nier leak will happen than a legit KH one nowadays.

 

[MATGSY]

I can think of few things worse than watching an HMK video, I'm afraid. HMK could make a video about the exact whereabouts of my long lost son and I still wouldn't watch it.

2025 is such an easy guess right now. If it comes to pass, it's not like it's evidence of some big scoop

Careful now, you don't wanna piss Xemnas off.

 

[Phoenix]

Hey guys, remember when KH came out in 2002, CoM in 2004 and KH2 in 2006? Those were good times.

 

[Launchpad]

Hey guys, remember when KH came out in 2002, CoM in 2004 and KH2 in 2006? Those were good times.

I mean, comparatively, is 2019 to 2025 really all that bad? I think to go longer than that is a bad move, but six years doesn't really feel all that long.

 

[Phoenix]

Well, I think so, yeah. Within those 4 years, we got 3 excellent games. Right now, the game we're desperately waiting on is the gacha one that we all know won't actually be fun to play and will EoS within a year. Even if KH4 comes out next year (which is an if), that's still pretty awful compared to how we started this series. KH5 is then, what, 2031? Jesus.

 

[MATGSY]

Hey guys, remember when KH came out in 2002, CoM in 2004 and KH2 in 2006? Those were good times.

1997: FF7
1998: FF Tactics
1999: FF8
2000: FF9
2001: FF10
2002: FF11

What a time it was.

 

[Phoenix]

1997: FF7
1998: FF Tactics
1999: FF8
2000: FF9
2001: FF10
2002: FF11

What a time it was.

Fuck, I hate how bloated and graphics heavy video games have become. We used to get banger after banger because they didn't cost a billion dollars each.

Give me Valkyrka Chronicles or Twilight Princess graphics over literally any PS4 or 5 game any day of the week. A fraction of the cost too.

 

[Liodin]

2003 and 2005 members longing for times gone by.

The good old days, right fellas?

For me, as a KH fan since 2007, there has been no better period of time than 2017-2022.

 

[Squood!]

Hey guys, remember when KH came out in 2002, CoM in 2004 and KH2 in 2006? Those were good times.

CoM is a GBA title.

Remove CoM and you get 2002 to 2006.

Just a couple years short.

And yeah, mobile game bad, but Ux had a decent lifespan. I've gotten cynical on ML but I wouldn't count it out after a year just yet.

 

[Luminary]

They just need to stick with UE5 for the entirety of the Lost Master arc and add one more team to develop KH games in the off years for numbered titles. I hope they’ve learned from Rebirth the value of continuity with both the engine and development staff.

 

[Phoenix]

CoM is a GBA title.

Remove CoM and you get 2002 to 2006.

Just a couple years short.

And yeah, mobile game bad, but Ux had a decent lifespan. I've gotten cynical on ML but I wouldn't count it out after a year just yet.

Why would I remove CoM? It was excellent. Because yes, mobile game bad. UX wasn't good. We were there for the drip fed story, not for the incredibly power crept barely gameplay.

I'm not being facetious, compare BBS to Dark Road. Which handheld strategy was better for fans?

 

[Antifa Lockhart]

Because CoM wasn't developed by the same team that did KH1, was their point. Removing it from the equation had nothing to do with the quality of the game and more to do with dev time and release cadence from a team.

The original KH team finished Final Mix in 2003 and began working on KH II (which originally released in Japan in December of 2005) So, ~ three years (but very close to four.)

The current KH team finished Re:Mind in 2020 and has been working on KH IV ever since. I think 2025 is a good guess and if that's the case a four/five year dev cycle isn't that different from a three/four dev cycle. It's actually really impressive, considering how much manpower it takes to develop a modern game. Granted, that's assuming it actually comes out next year.

I should also point out that even if you don't like UX or DR particularly well (god knows I hated Dark Road), there are plenty of people who did and Melody of Memory was a lot of fun.

 

[Chie]

I should also point out that even if you don't like UX or DR particularly well (god knows I hated Dark Road), there are plenty of people who did

I strongly feel like we can't, and shouldn't, treat abusive service games as just "a matter of opinion". I feel that the relation they have to the creative team is not comparable - most of UX's dev process was Nomura and one/two animators slooowly making cutscenes that happened to be attached to constant empty events of big numbers following a mathematical formula to specifically incite people to feel like they should pay a microtransaction (and, ideally, become addicted to doing so). That, to me, is not comparable to the development of, nor the act of playing, KH1, CoM, 2, Days, BBS, coded, DDD, 0.2, 3 or MoM.

 

[Liodin]

The current KH team finished Re:Mind in 2020 and has been working on KH IV ever since. I think 2025 is a good guess and if that's the case a four/five year dev cycle isn't that different from a three/four dev cycle. It's actually really impressive, considering how much manpower it takes to develop a modern game. Granted, that's assuming it actually comes out next year.

Also, don't forget that there was a pandemic, and some of the team had to help with FF XVI.

 

[HakaishinChampa]

If they show KH4 at SGF, I suppose the game could come out within 9-20 months if this 2025 date is to be believed.

I'm thinking Summer 2025 like FF16 or Fall 2025. That's the best case scenario.

Now it is possible that this 2025 game might be another Kingdom Hearts title, he did say KH4 but I imagine someone unfamiliar with the series will assume the game is KH4. It could be the Union X remake for all we know.

 

[Phoenix]

Because CoM wasn't developed by the same team that did KH1, was their point. Removing it from the equation had nothing to do with the quality of the game and more to do with dev time and release cadence from a team.

The original KH team finished Final Mix in 2003 and began working on KH II (which originally released in Japan in December of 2005) So, ~ three years (but very close to four.)

The current KH team finished Re:Mind in 2020 and has been working on KH IV ever since. I think 2025 is a good guess and if that's the case a four/five year dev cycle isn't that different from a three/four dev cycle. It's actually really impressive, considering how much manpower it takes to develop a modern game. Granted, that's assuming it actually comes out next year.

I should also point out that even if you don't like UX or DR particularly well (god knows I hated Dark Road), there are plenty of people who did and Melody of Memory was a lot of fun.

In addition to what Chie said (come on, let's not stand around pretending that Dark Road was a real game that people enjoyed for its gameplay), I don't think it particularly matters who made what. The fact remains that good games were coming out every two years. They had plenty of story, plenty of gameplay and were priced fairly.

What happens in the background (in house or outsourced) isn't my concern as a customer, at all. Their production line is their business. But SE *could* decline to make a phone game and instead make a small Switch title. They could, this is within their power! They could also decide to make KH4 less graphically intensive and focus on art style and good animation. Do I really, honestly have to argue that the BBS and CoM are better products for their customers than UX and DR? And it's incredibly self-evident why we don't get BBS quality anymore; BBS costs more money to produce than DR and, since there's no gambling in it, potentially makes less money.

My whole point is around design philosophy. Back in the early 2000s, their design philosophy was make good games, make good money when good games sell a lot, win-win. Their design philosophy today is, make gambling apps, exploit the vulnerable and the young, occasionally make a good game if there's time. As a long time fan, I find this incredibly disappointing.

 

[Antifa Lockhart]

I strongly feel like we can't, and shouldn't, treat abusive service games as just "a matter of opinion". I feel that the relation they have to the creative team is not comparable - most of UX's dev process was Nomura and one/two animators slooowly making cutscenes that happened to be attached to constant empty events of big numbers following a mathematical formula to specifically incite people to feel like they should pay a microtransaction (and, ideally, become addicted to doing so). That, to me, is not comparable to the development of, nor the act of playing, KH1, CoM, 2, Days, BBS, coded, DDD, 0.2, 3 or MoM.

In addition to what Chie said (come on, let's not stand around pretending that Dark Road was a real game that people enjoyed for its gameplay), I don't think it particularly matters who made what. The fact remains that good games were coming out every two years. They had plenty of story, plenty of gameplay and were priced fairly.

What happens in the background (in house or outsourced) isn't my concern as a customer, at all. Their production line is their business. But SE *could* decline to make a phone game and instead make a small Switch title. They could, this is within their power! They could also decide to make KH4 less graphically intensive and focus on art style and good animation. Do I really, honestly have to argue that the BBS and CoM are better products for their customers than UX and DR? And it's incredibly self-evident why we don't get BBS quality anymore; BBS costs more money to produce than DR and, since there's no gambling in it, potentially makes less money.

My whole point is around design philosophy. Back in the early 2000s, their design philosophy was make good games, make good money when good games sell a lot, win-win. Their design philosophy today is, make gambling apps, exploit the vulnerable and the young, occasionally make a good game if there's time. As a long time fan, I find this incredibly disappointing.

I'm not interested in arguing semantics or ethics on this since by-and-large I agree, but I think it's also important to point out that Dark Road is a free game that doesn't cost us anything -- not "potentially less money" for Square but literally none and did not and could not generate a profit for Square. That means a lot less when you realize it was probably made using UX's profits, but it's still worth noting.

If they show KH4 at SGF, I suppose the game could come out within 9-20 months if this 2025 date is to be believed.

I'm thinking Summer 2025 like FF16 or Fall 2025. That's the best case scenario.

Now it is possible that this 2025 game might be another Kingdom Hearts title, he did say KH4 but I imagine someone unfamiliar with the series will assume the game is KH4. It could be the Union X remake for all we know.

There's no reason to believe that there is a KHUX remake or that they'll sneak out another unannounced KH game before they release IV. That feels like a marketing catastrophe.

 

[Luminary]

If they show KH4 at SGF, I suppose the game could come out within 9-20 months if this 2025 date is to be believed.

I'm thinking Summer 2025 like FF16 or Fall 2025. That's the best case scenario.

Now it is possible that this 2025 game might be another Kingdom Hearts title, he did say KH4 but I imagine someone unfamiliar with the series will assume the game is KH4. It could be the Union X remake for all we know.

Rebirth had its first full trailer at SGF and then released in February the following year. So early 2025 is very much still possible. The fiscal year ends in March and I doubt SE wants to go all of FY2025 (April 2024-March 2025) without a AAA console release. If their talk about improving their AAA pipeline is accurate, there should be a AAA release around January-March of next year.

 

[Launchpad]

While two years is a long time, I'm having a hard time feeling the panic and despair that a lot of people seem to be feeling. Square has shortened their reveal-to-release strategy. FFXV and KH3 had an extremely long term trailer/press cycle. It came to the point that their trailers were becoming consumable entertainment for starving fans that already wanted the games, rather than advertisements to get newcomers on board.

Eventually, FFXVI shortened this reveal-to-release cycle. Then FF7 Rebirth shortened it even more. While KH4 has definitely already been 'revealed', we haven't seen any real gameplay, game content, nothing. Just an animation pretending to be gameplay depicting the obligatory 'spectacle boss' (Darkside, Twilight Thorn, KH3!Rock Titan) that showcases exciting bespoke animations. KH4's press cycle won't truly begin until the next trailer is shown, and what we'll be looking at will probably be a game that's just about done cooking, and just needs a few months to reveal Disney worlds, gameplay, and then release.

I don't know about you, but I'll take it over the often nauseating press experience that was KH3's release.