How I would have done it * SPOILERS*

[Eshutin]

K, First off, you can expect Spoilers in this thread, so stop now if you don't want to be spoiled.

You have been warned!!!!!!!!!

I just finished 358/2 days and just wanted to give my general thoughts on the game. Over all I enjoyed the game. It was fun, I liked the panel system. And I was really impressed with the graphic, considering it's a DS game. I was a little astonished to see how much they managed to fit on that tiny little cartridge.

Anywho, as I said, I did enjoy the game, but I must say, this game makes me feel like the KH story is getting a little to convoluted, a little to messy. I know that's a strange thing to say as this series has always been that way, but I think in 358/2 days it got messy in the wrong way. I always get annoyed with people who say they dislike something, but never have any better ideas. They just complain. Now before you all start ripping my head off, don't get me wrong. I don't pretend to have better ideas then the creator of this awesome series, after all it's his work and he can do whatever he pleases with it. Anyway, we all have our own opions on what makes a good story. I would like to share what I would have done with this game. I would also like to hear what you all think of my ideas, or if you think the game is perfect the way it is. Maybe you have or own ideas of how you would have done it, or have improvements to mine. Your general thoughts would be cool.

So first off, I would not have created Xion at all. I think generally speaking she is a completely unnecessary character. She doesn't add much to the plot and she is forgotten at the end of the game anyway making her even less significant. But, I must say the one thing I did really like about her concept was the fact that she gave a valid reason for Vexens Replica project. When I played CoM I thought the whole things was a little random and unnecessary for that game. But having Xion in this game validates that part of CoM for me, which was about the only thing I really had a problem with in that game. But I'm getting off topic. I also like how her appearance was dictated by a persons connection to Sora's memory and how most people saw her as just a hooded girl.

As a sort of general run through, I would have started the game with Roxas as a Zombie just like they did. But as I said I would not have had Xion there. I would have focus solely on Roxas's friendship with Axel. I also would have had him gain relationships with the other org members. See how he gets along with them. There is some of that in the game, but it's nothing special. I remember in KH2 when Sora meets Xigbar and he says, "He use to give me that exact same look." Sora seems a little annoyed with Xigbar when he says this. So We could have explored the story behind this. How Roxas maybe got annoyed with him regularly and often gave him the same look. Things like that.

As the focus for the game I would have looked more heavily into the fact that Roxas is Sora's nobody. I mean he doesn't really seem to realize it till the end of the game. Instead of Sora's memories going into Xion I would have had them going into Roxas. He could start getting all these flashes and starts asking questions that the org doesn't really want to answer. I always got the impression that Roxas was angry about being nothing but Sora's shadow. I would have like to explore that. How he came to know about Sora, how he wanted to meet Sora to prove that he was his own person. But the org wouldn't allow it, or something like that. Maybe explore how Roxas come to believe that he does have a heart of his own and weather or not actually does. Do more with how Roxas having a heart might affect Axel. How being around Roxas makes Axel feel like he has a heart. Maybe they could have had Roxas leave the Org sooner, and that is what makes them invest in the replica project. Obviously this would be later int the game, but after loosing roxas they could then begin to intercept Sora's memories and make a replica. But it would just be a blank face Sora replica, not Xion. Then roxas destroys it and goes to the world that never was to destroy Kingdom hearts.

In regards to him going to other worlds. Instead of him always hiding in the shadow, I would have liked to see how he and the rest of the Org interfere with that world. I mean in KH2 they are always meddling in the affairs of other worlds, but in this one they never want to be seen. I think it would have been cool if Roxas had been sent on missions where he's expected to do some bad things. Like Xaldin and Luxord in Beast's Castle and Port Royal. And maybe he would begin to question the motives of the Organization and wonder if what he is doing is right. And to not mess with KH2 stuff to much they could have done this stuff on worlds that don't appear in KH2, like Neverland, Wonderland and Pinocchio's world, had they not cut it. I also would have like some sort of conclusion to Saix and Axels little conspiracy, whatever it was. I think it had a lot of potential. As it is all it really did was give Axel a better reason for offing the other org members at C.O (namely Zexion)

I also wouldn't have had him only get his dual-wield at the end of the game. I who have had him get it about half way through the game. Maybe after receiving certain memories from Sora. Memories that really make him wonder what Friendship is or something important like that. Plus it just doesn't make sense as his proof of existence has the two Keyblades on it and he did get them till after leaving. On that note I would have like to have been able to explore more of The Castle. Maybe be able to enter the other Org members room in the proof of existence area, maybe even Roxas's. I would also have like for them to keep lesser nobodies as party members or summons.

I do realize that most of what i am saying would require a lot of cutscenes and thus a lot of space which they don't really have for the DS. This is a bit of ideal sort of thing. I just think that they are trying to fit to much into to short a time. The story they have introduces a whole new plot line, which I think makes the story feel a little crowded. My ideas explore the ideas that where always there. It doesn't introduce a new story, it simply explains the one that was hinted at in KH2. Which I, obviously, think was what was needed here. I expected 358/2 days to explore Roxas's character, but it didn't really, not till the last 5 days or so of the game. It was only within those last couple days that he finally start questioning things.

Despite my rather large novel saying otherwise, I did enjoy the game well enough, it's just not how I would have done it. Which is fine.

[Neo]

Is there any need to make two threads about the same thing?

[Eshutin]

Do you really think I did it on purpose?

[Neo]

Originally Posted by Eshutin

Do you really think I did it on purpose?

Yes.

This actually happens.

[Eshutin]

I see. Well, no, I did not do it on purpose. And I'll try not to make such a horrible mistake again.

[∞]

Wait, so you didn't want yaoi-shield Xion to be in there?

[Eshutin]

lol yaoi-shield Xion, I never thought of that. While I don't want any yaoi going on between them, friendship is still a good theme and can make a good story.

It is good to give Xion something useful to do though lol.

[Original Sin]

Originally Posted by Eshutin

As the focus for the game I would have looked more heavily into the fact that Roxas is Sora's nobody. I mean he doesn't really seem to realize it till the end of the game. Instead of Sora's memories going into Xion I would have had them going into Roxas. He could start getting all these flashes and starts asking questions that the org doesn't really want to answer.

He did have flashes. He knew about the "kid in red", but didn't know that it was his Somebody. I just don't think he ever felt comfortable talking about them with the Organization; for obvious reasons. They were all very cold towards him.

Whenever he did have a chance to discuss them with either Xion or Axel, I don't think he really wanted to. He was too "happy" just having ice cream with them.

[destinykh]

In regards to him going to other worlds. Instead of him always hiding in the shadow, I would have liked to see how he and the rest of the Org interfere with that world. I mean in KH2 they are always meddling in the affairs of other worlds, but in this one they never want to be seen. I think it would have been cool if Roxas had been sent on missions where he's expected to do some bad things. Like Xaldin and Luxord in Beast's Castle and Port Royal. And maybe he would begin to question the motives of the Organization and wonder if what he is doing is right. And to not mess with KH2 stuff to much they could have done this stuff on worlds that don't appear in KH2, like Neverland, Wonderland and Pinocchio's world, had they not cut it.

You have to remember that each Organization member has a purpose. Roxas was essentially nothing more than a tool the Organization could use to harvest hearts. Unlike the other members like Xaldin, who had to interfere in worlds so that he can find and manipulate sources of great power which he can put under the Org's control, Roxas had no business stirring up trouble by himself. What if he messes up, and unknowingly foil the Org's plans? He is a newbie after all. It would make more sense for him to help other Organization members to achieve their goals, just for the sake of having him question the Org's morality, but his primary missions would mostly be centered on heart collecting.

[Eshutin]

He did have flashes. He knew about the "kid in red", but didn't know that it was his Somebody. I just don't think he ever felt comfortable talking about them with the Organization; for obvious reasons. They were all very cold towards him.

Whenever he did have a chance to discuss them with either Xion or Axel, I don't think he really wanted to. He was too "happy" just having ice cream with them.

In KH2 he seems to have a bit of a temper. He asked a about it about half way through the game and Xemnas just told him to shut it basically. I would have expected him to push the issue a bit more. Not just let it drop altogether till the end of the game. And my God, do these people never get sick of ice cream. lol I mean 358 days straight of the stuff.

You have to remember that each Organization member has a purpose. Roxas was essentially nothing more than a tool the Organization could use to harvest hearts. Unlike the other members like Xaldin, who had to interfere in worlds so that he can find and manipulate sources of great power which he can put under the Org's control, Roxas had no business stirring up trouble by himself. What if he messes up, and unknowingly foil the Org's plans? He is a newbie after all. It would make more sense for him to help other Organization members to achieve their goals, just for the sake of having him question the Org's morality, but his primary missions would mostly be centered on heart collecting.

No, I wouldn't expect Roxas to make trouble himself. If anything he would start making trouble for the Org, by going against what they asked him to do. And sure it makes sense, He wields the Keyblade, so sure they are going to use him mostly for collecting hearts. But, like you said, it would have been cool if they showed him helping other org members complete their missions. Maybe view them turning someone into a heartless, like Xaldin was trying to do to the Beast, then expect Roxas to finish him.

I can understand Xemnas and Saix seeing him as nothing more than a tool (they see everyone that way) But he could have done more with the other members I think. Considering all the opportunities, we really did get to know any of the other org members any better.

[Smile]

Originally Posted by Eshutin

K, First off, you can expect Spoilers in this thread, so stop now if you don't want to be spoiled.

that's what we have a SPOILERS section for. :\

Anywho, as I said, I did enjoy the game, but I must say, this game makes me feel like the KH story is getting a little to convoluted, a little to messy.

I'd blame it sooner on them trying to hint to things they can't explain because the game explaining it is just around the corner, being BBS. Play that and then judge. You can't judge a picture by having less than all the pieces of the puzzle.

So first off, I would not have created Xion at all. I think generally speaking she is a completely unnecessary character. She doesn't add much to the plot and she is forgotten at the end of the game anyway making her even less significant.

At the very basis of it I agree with you, seeing how she was created because Nomura wanted Roxas to leave the Organization because of a girl his age. The concept on its own makes me cringe and want to vomit as that's the kind of horrid, dreadful thinking process that made them think SoKai is a good idea.
However, the concept was left far, far behind after I played the game. If only for her being about the best female character in the series if not arguably THE very best character (I still like Riku more xD), she deserved to have been there.
To top it all, I for one strongly believe the girl actually had quite a lot to do with Riku wielding the Keyblade again, to throw a possible plot relation off the top of my head. If that should come to pass, it would be hard to call her insignificant. At the moment? You seem to be right, but that's it - seem to. She's a character that imo cannot be judged until the very end of the series. Nomura does like to throw plot curve-balls at us, and with Xion following Namine's concept of being Forgotten but not Lost, there's plenty of things they could do with her should they choose to.

But, I must say the one thing I did really like about her concept was the fact that she gave a valid reason for Vexens Replica project. When I played CoM I thought the whole things was a little random and unnecessary for that game. But having Xion in this game validates that part of CoM for me, which was about the only thing I really had a problem with in that game. But I'm getting off topic. I also like how her appearance was dictated by a persons connection to Sora's memory and how most people saw her as just a hooded girl.

Wait and watch her become about the biggest tie in to BBS we've seen thus far, what with the possible and likely Replica theories relating to that game as well :\ Oh, and I didn't write off completely Aqua relations to her. Would certainly tie in nicely with her not looking QUITE like Kairi and with Aqua bits as well, if Memories of Ven lurking inside Roxas dictated that part of her appearance as well.

As a sort of general run through, I would have started the game with Roxas as a Zombie just like they did. But as I said I would not have had Xion there. I would have focus solely on Roxas's friendship with Axel. I also would have had him gain relationships with the other org members. See how he gets along with them. There is some of that in the game, but it's nothing special.

...it's the vast majority of the game :\ they based Roxas with the CoM cast and Axel before they even bothered with Xion herself, and even then there was a short time in which Roxas was with Xion but thought about Axel, until she unhooded herself.

I remember in KH2 when Sora meets Xigbar and he says, "He use to give me that exact same look." Sora seems a little annoyed with Xigbar when he says this. So We could have explored the story behind this. How Roxas maybe got annoyed with him regularly and often gave him the same look. Things like that.

"Why do you always look like I just drowned your Goldfish?"
He was probably talking about Ven more than he was about Roxas.

As the focus for the game I would have looked more heavily into the fact that Roxas is Sora's nobody. I mean he doesn't really seem to realize it till the end of the game.

How and why should he have done that? :\ he had no clue himself until Xion's identity crisis kicked in.

Instead of Sora's memories going into Xion I would have had them going into Roxas. He could start getting all these flashes and starts asking questions that the org doesn't really want to answer. I always got the impression that Roxas was angry about being nothing but Sora's shadow. I would have like to explore that.

The only reason he bothered was because they wanted Sora to "eat him up". I was rather content with how they portrayed his reaction to the flashes, being that he saw them but didn't relate them to himself, seeing how they're not supposed to be his Memories - he's just supposed to be a container.

Do more with how Roxas having a heart might affect Axel. How being around Roxas makes Axel feel like he has a heart.

BBS turf, hun. Wouldn't have happened for the world. They played it risky enough with the Ven flash. Questioning Roxas's possible Heart would've gone too far.

Maybe they could have had Roxas leave the Org sooner, and that is what makes them invest in the replica project.

Only plot wise it makes no sense since they'd have had no basis for the replica.

Obviously this would be later int the game, but after loosing roxas they could then begin to intercept Sora's memories and make a replica.

Only without Namine or the castle, they'd have had all but no means of pulling that off. I see where you're getting at but it really is nothing short of impossible with what was presented, without relations to Xion.

Then roxas destroys it and goes to the world that never was to destroy Kingdom hearts.

Congratulations, you just destroyed the one emotional point of worth in the whole game - the friendship between Roxas, Xion and Axel :\ Axel and Roxas wouldn't have had half the impact they have now without Xion. (needless to say, I do not disapprove of how they pulled most things off in the game)

In regards to him going to other worlds. Instead of him always hiding in the shadow, I would have liked to see how he and the rest of the Org interfere with that world.

o_O yeah. No. They explained nicely why that couldn't have came to pass. They're not Sora, Donald and Goofy. They actually know what they're doing.

I mean in KH2 they are always meddling in the affairs of other worlds

They're not supposed to be, that's the catch, but Heartless and Nobodies are the cause of mayhem and hence they have to.

I think it would have been cool if Roxas had been sent on missions where he's expected to do some bad things. Like Xaldin and Luxord in Beast's Castle and Port Royal.

Aside from Roxas having a different task in the Organization, I doubt giving Sora's Nobody the task of doing evil things would've gone down well. He IS Sora's Nobody, and even without his Memories, some things didn't change. He wouldn't have questioned it, he simply wouldn't have done it. Like he asked Lexaeus - are they good deeds?
Roxas isn't the type to do stuff just because they're good - for the Organization.

I also wouldn't have had him only get his dual-wield at the end of the game. I who have had him get it about half way through the game. Maybe after receiving certain memories from Sora.

Only the reason he had it to begin with was the VEN Memories Xion brought along with her. Good luck pulling that off without getting too deep into BBS turf.

Plus it just doesn't make sense as his proof of existence has the two Keyblades on it and he did get them till after leaving.

Why not? He was still a member. And to top it all, how do you know that his Proof doesn't include Xion in it as well? I wouldn't be surprised if that's why. They were never more than 13 members, true, but it doesn't matter who'd have been left standing, Xion or Roxas. They're one and the same for the Org. Why not mark it as such?

I do realize that most of what i am saying would require a lot of cutscenes and thus a lot of space which they don't really have for the DS.

No, it just couldn't have happened :\ as simple as that. Part of why they didn't pull it off, me thinks. You should stop and think about that for a minute, too. KH isn't where it ALL can happen. They introduced the replica program, true, but didn't break too much past that.

I expected 358/2 days to explore Roxas's character, but it didn't really, not till the last 5 days or so of the game. It was only within those last couple days that he finally start questioning things.

Because he had all but no reason to do so otherwise.
Look at how the Org handled him, without relation to Xion. Assume it would've went on for the entire year. Axel was still there, still his best friend. He was still filling up with Sora's Memories without them relating to him but more dreams that he shrugged at. What possible reason would he have had to leaving?
That's the Organization as they described it for us - without relation to Xion. Remove Xion, you remove Roxas's identity crisis, and his reasons to go berserk at Axel. Hence, you remove his motivation to leaving the Org. Why? Because so long as Axel was there and Luxord would've been polite enough and Xigbar would've 'cared about his future' and they'd have kept under wraps everything dirty they were doing from Roxas - he wouldn't have lost his place to be at.
Xemnas wins.