Agnosticism and the Major Stupidity of it

[Cool man]

I nowadays read on many a forums people who, at the expense of atheism, convert their beliefs to agnosticism because they find atheism to be illogical. As it also turns out, most of these people have no shit-idea as to what the hell agnosticism is anyway.

Agnosticism is not the belief that one believes in a God-like figure but can never know its true identity. If you believe that, you fit in to the category of agnosticism quite well, but not in the damn way you thought you did.

No. Agnosticism is the denial of all knowledge. It's in the name: "a", as in "without" or "taken away" + "gnosis" as greek for "knowledge".

Seriously, you agnostics. Isn't your belief so fantastically humiliating? To admit you're absolutely clueless about everything? What do you really have to live for if you can't know any meaning of it? Becuase that just almost about blends nihilism and agnosticism into one singular "belief"!

Enlighten me please. Your lives seem so utterly worthless to me through this.

[Guardian Soul]

no religious bashing.

And I thought that agnosticism was where you just believe that you aren't able to know if God exists or not.

Since we can't be sure, I would assume that's one of the most logical religions.

[The Scarecrow]

Obviously when someone says they're agnostic in a religious sense (such as myself, for one), they're speaking, well, in terms of religion.

Also, you're retarded. You're confusing the meaning of 'gnosis'. Whilst it may have been used by the Greek for 'knowledge', in common English it's used to describe spiritual knowledge.

Originally Posted by The Free Online Dictionary

'gno·sis (nss)
n.
Intuitive apprehension of spiritual truths, an esoteric form of knowledge sought by the Gnostics.

Originally Posted by Merriam-Webster Online:

'gnosis
Main Entry:
gno·sis Listen to the pronunciation of gnosis
Pronunciation:
\ˈnō-səs\
Function:
noun
Etymology:
Greek gnōsis, literally, knowledge, from gignōskein
Date:
1703
: esoteric knowledge of spiritual truth held by the ancient Gnostics to be essential to salvation'

Also;

Originally Posted by Dictionary.Com

ag·nos·tic Audio Help /ægˈnɒstɪk/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[ag-nos-tik] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun
1. a person who holds that the existence of the ultimate cause, as God, and the essential nature of things are unknown and unknowable, or that human knowledge is limited to experience.
2. a person who denies or doubts the possibility of ultimate knowledge in some area of study.
–adjective
3. of or pertaining to agnostics or agnosticism.
4. asserting the uncertainty of all claims to knowledge.

Words change meaning over time. Take the word 'sinister' for example. Nowadays it means evil, but way back when it was Latin for 'left-handed'.


But uh, hey, maybe you're right. Then again, seeing as I'm agnostic, I deny your knowledge.

[Cool man]

Scarecrow, that: "Intuitive apprehension of spiritual truths, an esoteric form of knowledge sought by the Gnostics", is by the Gnostics. By the damn Gnostics; doesn't have anything to do with the actual word "gnosis". And how do you for that matter deny my knowledge? That doesn't make sense at all.

And I apologise for my religious bashing. I realized that after the making.

And Guardian Soul - okay, logic religion, right. A logic way of life? I don't think so.

[The Scarecrow]

I don't know how you're refuting what I said, but I'll say it again, a bit simpler this time.

In this modern day and age, agnosticism, or at least the agnosticism I adopt, is the belief that the certain knowledge of the existence of any god, deity, or higher power, is ultimately unknowable. Regardless of what the word may have meant in ancient Greek, or whatever it may translate to in any other language, that's what it means here and now.

Besides, the meaning of the word doesn't change what I believe. You could call it hooplah and I'd still believe it.

And uh,

And how do you for that matter deny my knowledge? That doesn't make sense at all.

I was being clever, but you didn't get it.

Originally Posted by you

Agnosticism is the denial of all knowledge. It's in the name: "a", as in "without" or "taken away" + "gnosis" as greek for "knowledge".

You know, denial of knowledge, I deny your knowledge, etc, etc..

[HadesDragon]

Originally Posted by The Scarecrow

In this modern day and age, agnosticism, or at least the agnosticism I adopt, is the belief that the certain knowledge of the existence of any god, deity, or higher power, is ultimately unknowable. Regardless of what the word may have meant in ancient Greek, or whatever it may translate to in any other language, that's what it means here and now..

This is what I believe in as well.

And uh, cool man, I'm not sure you are aware of this, but there IS such a thing as an agnostic atheist.

If you wanted to find the truth about the origins of the universe and whatnot, I believe you should first admit you don't know much about it, or anything at all. It's just honesty.

[Hollow Bastion]

Thanks for pointing out something most of us already know, but you fail to realize that the term "agnosticism" is generally used in terms of religion nowadays.

As such, an "agnostic" is someone who denies absolute knowledge (for some, only for the time being) regarding the existence of a deity

[Xanagar]

Originally Posted by Cool man

Seriously, you agnostics. Isn't your belief so fantastically humiliating? To admit you're absolutely clueless about everything? What do you really have to live for if you can't know any meaning of it? Becuase that just almost about blends nihilism and agnosticism into one singular "belief"!

Enlighten me please. Your lives seem so utterly worthless to me through this.

Since when was there knowledge behind religion? In the end, everyone is "clueless about everything." Regardless of one's religion, no one knows what's truly the cause of life (God, not God, etc.). It seems logical, actually, and rather bold, to come out and say, "I don't know." I always thought that religion was powered by faith, not fact.

The only thing more worthless than this thread is the lack of open-mindedness behind its origin.

[The Silent Soldier]

Originally Posted by Cool man

I nowadays read on many a forums people who, at the expense of atheism, convert their beliefs to agnosticism because they find atheism to be illogical. As it also turns out, most of these people have no shit-idea as to what the hell agnosticism is anyway.

I am agnostic and I know what it mean:

Agnostic - The belief that knowledge is limited or absolute knowledge can not exist/reached.

That just killed your argument.

Originally Posted by Cool man

Seriously, you agnostics. Isn't your belief so fantastically humiliating? To admit you're absolutely clueless about everything? What do you really have to live for if you can't know any meaning of it? Becuase that just almost about blends nihilism and agnosticism into one singular "belief"!

We're not clueless we, just deny that certain things can not be completely known.

[Thelonepickle]

D:

Can I just say, the 's' on your "many a forums" is redundant? D: IT SHOULDN'T BE THERE.

You're making friends all over the place. Are you angry because you're losing atheists or something? That's so ridiculous. You're making a fool out of yourself!

How in the world did you get SO UNBELIEVABLY ANGRY that you have to go onto a children's videogame's forum and make a thread about how worthless some people are, in your sight? Couldn't you just... Punch a baby or something?

Jeez.

[Domon Kasshu]

That ain't cool, Cool Man. Don't be hatin' on my religion.

[Cool man]

Okay, I admit my defeat. You all win. Religious bashing is out of place here anyway apparently. And my definition of religion is also apparently wildly different from the one you're all adopting. And while that really should not be, it isn't your fault, so I won't begin that discussion. (especially not with someone who uses the fact that we're in a subforum for religious, intel-discussion as an argument as to why I shouldn't discuss... religious, intel-matters)

Originally Posted by The Scarecrow

And uh,


I was being clever, but you didn't get it.



You know, denial of knowledge, I deny your knowledge, etc, etc..

Okay. Ha ha. That's... very clever of you.

[Morningstar]

Originally Posted by Cool man

And my definition of religion is also appearently wildly different from the one you're all adopting. And while that really should not be, it isn't your fault, so I won't begin that discussion.

It sounds like you're pitying us and our apparent inability to understand your point.

We're just as right as you are, if not more.

[Tobuoi]

The term "agnosticism" is somewhat vague, as is appropriate for its meaning. However, the term "atheist" is vague, as well. All it means to be an atheist is that you don't believe in a god(s).

1. the doctrine or belief that there is no God.
2. disbelief in the existence of a supreme being or beings.

1. a. Disbelief in or denial of the existence of God or gods. b. The doctrine that there is no God or gods.

"Atheism, as an explicit position, either affirms the nonexistence of gods[1] or rejects theism.[2]"

I, personally, do not believe in God, but to call myself an atheist really wouldn't be all that different from calling myself an agnostic, because neither of them have a very clear set of beliefs, which is part of what makes them such a seperate category of "religion," or lack thereof. So sure, my disbelief in God makes me an atheist, but my lack of understanding of the world's unsolved mysteries makes me an agnostic. And I really don't believe that we'll ever completely understand life, if for no other reason than we'll go extinct before then. That's why I've been rather reluctant to calling myself either an atheist or an agnostic...oh, and it has NOTHING to do any sort of potential regret or, "Oh, I'll just call myself an agnostic, JUST IN CASE there turns out to be a God." Nothing like that. Just wanted to throw that out before/if I'm warranted with such an accusation.

Anyways, that's what I've found to be as close to the "truth" in my understanding, during my sixteen years of existence.

[Phoenix]

lulz word meanings totally never change over time

And my definition of religion is also appearently wildly different from the one you're all adopting. And while that really should not be, it isn't your fault, so I won't begin that discussion.

re·li·gion Audio Help /rɪˈlɪdʒən/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[ri-lij-uhn] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun
1. a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, esp. when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs.


Your move, angry man : <