Loosing Faith

[New2Ya]

As I am not a believer in a God that will just fix your problems when needed, my advice will be hard to accept maybe.

The thing is, you are the one to act. Don't wait for something to happen, as that is not the way life works.

The problem with many religious people is that they always just sit and wait around for a God to help them. If God would be so helpful for people with problems (I'm talking BIG problems here, millions of children dying of starvation every year kind of problems) there would be no problems in this world.

God is nothing but hope for people to go on, to continue living. In a way, it's their meaning of life.

I myself do not believe in a God in that concept. I am certain there is some sort of higher power, even though I even stronger believe that that higher power is within ourselves.

We have the power to change things. It's the choices we make that influence our lives.

You have two options. Wait for a God that will not help you, as God is simply inside of yourself. The other option is to take action and release that inner power.

That means you will have to face your problems.

Talk to your mother about her problems. Ask for support from other family members while doing so. An alcoholic will never accept its addiction. She will only blame you, by portraying her mishaves. You can not do this alone, trust me. If you don't have family to rely on, look for other ways. The best way would be to get her into an institution so she can get off the alcohol. Again, you will not be able to do that alone. You need emotional support from others.

Confront your sister. Basically this is the same situation as your mother. The reason your sister is addicted probably has to do with issues in her life. Maybe you can help her fix those problems in her life, and thus helping her searching for ways to escape from it (which in this case is drugs)

Visit your aunt as much as you can, as so you can be her pillar of light. Become HER hope, do not let her become yours. She's the one who's facing the hardest struggle of her life most probably, and thus emotional support is all she needs. No one becomes better again without believing they can become better.

As for the divorce, this probably is linked to your mother being an alcoholic (the divorce is the result of her being alcoholic, or the other way around). This could also be one of the bigger reasons why your sister is a drug-addict.

That's the way life works. Everything is linked to each other.

Now don't expect you being able to fix everything. That is not in your power. However, you do have the power to try. Become their hope. Become their "God".

[Forever Atlas]

^ seriously he didnt ask for you to help him become atheist, he asked for help to not give up on his faith and his situation.......

the Bible doesnt teach that God will just fix our problem through some sort of miracle. In accord with the Bible, we are the ones that have to take the steps to work on situations we have, and many times God does provide a way out... but usually its just a way to cope and a way to deal giving comfort and help that he provides.... not miracles.

and why would u even introduce the idea of making him become their god?....... -.- whether you are religious or not.....

also he says he doesnt have anyone to talk to. Its very easy for us to give him advice. Its much harder for him to take it. So just going up to someone and talking to them about the problems, especially the ones causing the problems is not easy at all....

But i do agree with you in one place, he should talk to his aunt at least and offer her comfort. Usually we in turn recieve encouragement when we encourage others.

[dejah]

^ you're totally misunderstanding what he is trying to say.

the strength in god is in one's self.
the major religions believe that.
it's just that people are so blindingly asking for things
and blinded by what these things will bring them. in other words, greed.
that they never realise that what they seek for is in themselves.

to believe in god, is to believe in yourself and/that god believes in you.

and he is right to say that if god grants all prayers, there would be no problems in the world, but there still are.
it's only because the people are asking for the wrong things.
they're asking for self-gratification.
asking for mercy, begging for mercy.
begging for a good life.
when asking things, when praying to god, one must humble yourself.
who are we to demand things from god?
earn it. make it for your own and on your own, then only will one truly appreciate what he has earned for himself. he would learn the true value of things.
You can't ask god for riches or for him to make things better with the snap of fingers.
you can only ask him to help him show you the right path to take, for you to make your life better.

sure New2Ya may be atheist and not believe in god, but some parts of what he says is but a better grasp of religion than most that's posted here.

you both just have different ideas, but all leading to the same conclusion.

also he says he doesnt have anyone to talk to. Its very easy for us to give him advice. Its much harder for him to take it. So just going up to someone and talking to them about the problems, especially the ones causing the problems is not easy at all....

they aren't just someones. they're his family. and if he cares that much, he'd want to try his damn hardest to fix their problems. no matter what it takes. intervention must come from people who care the most about someone. that's the only way it'll ever work.
he has us to talk to now. isn't that why we're posting on this thread?

and what he meant by become their "god"
is to give them hope, help them try to fix themselves, show them what they're doing to themselves and get them to get back on their feet.

[New2Ya]

^ seriously he didnt ask for you to help him become atheist, he asked for help to not give up on his faith and his situation.......

If him becoming an atheist helps him with his problems in his life, I greatly support that. Same if him staying a Christian.

and why would u even introduce the idea of making him become their god?....... -.- whether you are religious or not.....

If you don't have the ability to understand that (I think I made it pretty clear) then there's no bother in explaining it.

also he says he doesnt have anyone to talk to. Its very easy for us to give him advice. Its much harder for him to take it. So just going up to someone and talking to them about the problems, especially the ones causing the problems is not easy at all....

Funny how he asks for advice and when I give it, your ranting on about how I shouldn't give him advice as it won't help him. Think about that for a second. I never said it would be easy, but never is the right path the easy path. The path to salvation will always cost you a hard time. If that means confronting your biggest fear (in this case probably the fear of losing the love and respect of your family) that may have to be a sacrifice he has to make. Families are usually big enough for people to rely on others than just their closest ones. If his father can't help, and a possible grandmother/grandfother/uncle doesn't want to help either, I already told him to look at others outside the family.

and why would u even introduce the idea of making him become their god?....... -.- whether you are religious or not.....

Fine, I'll explain the concept of God being yourself a bit better.

In the Bible it says God created humans as an image of himself. Now we can ask ourselves, in which way? Physically? That would be the most ignorant idea ever. The physical part of humans is the least important factor of ourselves. It's just a shell. What makes us special, is our soul and our mind, and last but not least our spirit.

If that means we are the image of God in the way our mind works, and our soul and spirit, that means what's inside us is what makes us the image of God. Better said, that's our divine, our heavenly inside.
That makes us God.

What's inside is the divine within us, thus we can use those powers to change things.

That's what I was trying to explain to you.

It changes the concept of God, but it makes us much stronger. Don't be afraid to question things, as that is exactly what we should do in the 21st century. Rely on words from 2000 years ago (written by men, let me add) or work it out yourself. That may make me an atheist (though that would just make me non-Christian) but at least I can believe in myself, instead of relying on others.

Thanks dejah, you basically explained my post before. At least someone understands me.

[dejah]

x)
<3

and also, to point out something that New2Ya said,

one shouldn't be afraid to question religion.
that's just how we explore and find out more.
for example,
a christian shouldn't just stick to the bible strictly.
same goes for a muslim and his quran.
read other holy books as well, learn the stories and study the similarities and create your own opinion.
you're not being any less religious if you question, it's just merely finding out as much as you can and learning.

[Forever Atlas]

Originally Posted by New2Ya

If you don't have the ability to understand that (I think I made it pretty clear) then there's no bother in explaining it.

I understood it very well. But you could have used the word "hope" "strength" "encouragement" etc. instead of "God" especially with a capital "G".... but thats not whats important anyway....

Originally Posted by New2Ya

Funny how he asks for advice and when I give it, your ranting on about how I shouldn't give him advice as it won't help him. Think about that for a second. I never said it would be easy, but never is the right path the easy path. The path to salvation will always cost you a hard time. If that means confronting your biggest fear (in this case probably the fear of losing the love and respect of your family) that may have to be a sacrifice he has to make. Families are usually big enough for people to rely on others than just their closest ones. If his father can't help, and a possible grandmother/grandfother/uncle doesn't want to help either, I already told him to look at others outside the family.

Where did I say not to give him advice? But I know I go through really hard times and people are always like "talk to someone talk to someone" yada yada.... I really dont have 1 single person to talk to about important matters. So maybe he doesnt either. All i was saying is, he's smart, he knows if he could feel like he could talk to someone then im sure he would.

Originally Posted by New2Ya

Fine, I'll explain the concept of God being yourself a bit better. In the Bible it says God created humans as an image of himself. Now we can ask ourselves, in which way? Physically? That would be the most ignorant idea ever. The physical part of humans is the least important factor of ourselves. It's just a shell. What makes us special, is our soul and our mind, and last but not least our spirit.

Except there is no mention of a soul or spirit in the Bible other what it is... the soul is simply the body according to the Bible.

Originally Posted by New2Ya

If that means we are the image of God in the way our mind works, and our soul and spirit, that means what's inside us is what makes us the image of God. Better said, that's our divine, our heavenly inside. That makes us God.

Really the image of God was mainly speaking about the qualities that he made us have, his attributes. God is a spirit... we are flesh, no way we could be like him in any other ways....

So in other words.... if we resemble someone or have similar qualitites... we are them? Wow, I guess I am my mom... and my dad, and my sisters, oh and dont forget that guy on the other side of the world that i dont know. :D

Originally Posted by New2Ya

It changes the concept of God, but it makes us much stronger. Don't be afraid to question things, as that is exactly what we should do in the 21st century. Rely on words from 2000 years ago (written by men, let me add) or work it out yourself. That may make me an atheist (though that would just make me non-Christian) but at least I can believe in myself, instead of relying on others.

Oh nooooo c'mon I question things all the time... even if you are Christian as I have said many many times over and over, you are supposed to question things, and test things out for yourself. Find out things on your own etc. Never follow the words of anyone or anything blindly.

[Elegant Esthetics]

Technically, you are your mom, dad, sister, even me (as much as I hate that). Our bodies are all made of the same substances, so we're all each other. The things separating us are often intangible; perceptions, thoughts, mannerisms, etc.

[New2Ya]

I understood it very well. But you could have used the word "hope" "strength" "encouragement" etc. instead of "God" especially with a capital "G".... but thats not whats important anyway....

The words hope, encouragement, etc are not nearly as powerful as what we are.

People need to start realising that the being, the creature, the faith, whatever they see as God, that is simply within themselves. Instead of relying on something that will not solve your problems, rely on yourself. As you have the power that you're waiting for.

Where did I say not to give him advice? But I know I go through really hard times and people are always like "talk to someone talk to someone" yada yada.... I really dont have 1 single person to talk to about important matters. So maybe he doesnt either. All i was saying is, he's smart, he knows if he could feel like he could talk to someone then im sure he would.

Sometimes you need to look further than just the people that are very close to you. A lot of times people are waiting to help you, but you just ignore them.

Except there is no mention of a soul or spirit in the Bible other what it is... the soul is simply the body according to the Bible.

And here I thought the Bible teached us about the Holy Spirit. My God, I've always been reading the Bible wrong!! And what is up with soul being one of the keywords that are spoken of within the Church. God's holy place must really be ignorant of using words that have nothing to do with Christianity. Bravo Pope, Bravo Jesus!

Something that distinguishes us from rocks, plants and animals, according to the majority of mankind alas the religious, is that humans have souls.

But apparently you seem to differ.

Really the image of God was mainly speaking about the qualities that he made us have, his attributes. God is a spirit... we are flesh, no way we could be like him in any other ways....

And his attributes are what. Good and evil? Can't be, God is neither good or evil. Love and hate? Etc. The divine attribute that human beings have is their soul and their mental power.

So in other words.... if we resemble someone or have similar qualitites... we are them? Wow, I guess I am my mom... and my dad, and my sisters, oh and dont forget that guy on the other side of the world that i dont know. :D

As Dawning Kensei pointed out, we are all the same. We all are God's children.

Divine resembling human beings, or one human being the same as the other. It's something entirely different. Thus this comparison of yours doesn't add up at all. Try harder.

You're trying to make a joke of my posts and it seems your just mocking me for the sake of being righteous or winning a conversation (use some solid arguments for once, that would definetly help you achieve your goal here) and that's why I'm not going to get deeper into this.

Let's hope WatcherX can use some of my advice and others who understand what I mean and added some extra comments and so he can work out his problems.

[Phoenix]

Well, certainly don't become an atheist based on personal problems. I'm sorry to be cold here, but you should've known that people suffer every day since the beginning of the human race. It's a tad selfish to stay a Christian when you're aware that people get tortured, then start doubting when something happens to your situation personally.

You become an atheist now out of sadness and anger, your situation gets better, boom, you ask God's forgiveness and praise how smart He is in His actions. Then you're used as an example for atheists converting into Christians by some one who doesn't even know you.

Never question your faith based on your emotions, it's the worst thing you can do. In my mind, any conversion based off anger or sadness towards the god of your respective religion is invalid.

If you want to seriously question your faith, do it via reason and logic. Do not put your own situation above other people's. There are people who are tortured that remain Christians, and there are very happy people that are Atheists; you've got it all. Just calm down and wait a while before considering any major conversions =/

[Forever Atlas]

Okay New2Ya..... Im just saying... you are trying to teach supposed Christian beliefs when you yourself said you dont even believe in God? Your doctrines might be related to a god, but its not according to the Hebrew and Greek Scripture Bible beliefs.

And I agree with Phoenix. Instead of questioning beliefs because of emotions etc. do it because you want to find truths. Emotions can make us make illogical and unreasonable choices and many times cloud our thinking. So if you are going to question your beliefs, do it go ahead. But dont do it just because your situation isnt what you'd like it to be =/

[dejah]

Originally Posted by Phoenix

Never question your faith based on your emotions, it's the worst thing you can do. In my mind, any conversion based off anger or sadness towards the god of your respective religion is invalid.

Quoted for emphasis.

Originally Posted by Smooth

I understood it very well. But you could have used the word "hope" "strength" "encouragement" etc. instead of "God" especially with a capital "G".... but thats not whats important anyway....

i honestly think that you don't understand what he's trying to say.
what he meant was merely metaphorical, that the thread starter should help his family out and show them the way, help them better themselves, instead of whining about his family not being better.

ps. thread starter: seriously, do something about it. you gotta help your family before anyone else can.

Originally Posted by Smooth

Really the image of God was mainly speaking about the qualities that he made us have, his attributes. God is a spirit... we are flesh, no way we could be like him in any other ways....

my personal opinion is that god is the greatest being,
i also think that saying that god is a spirit would be rather disrespectful. god is not a spiritual being. god is spirit itself. spirit comes from the word "breath". god is breath. same as how god is love.
you got your phrase wrong.
we are flesh but we have spirit(breath) too.
without this spirit(breath) we are nothing.
so yah. god is spirit. god isn't a spirit

[Forever Atlas]

ok... well, i have different thoughts on the matters. so we will disagree. but lets not turn this into a debate. if we want to discuss those ideas, then make another thread. this one should focus back on the issue at hand to help our fellow man out here to not give up on his own self, his fam., and his faith. sorry to have started n e thing

[Phoenix]

this one should focus back on the issue at hand to help our fellow man out here to not give up on his own self, his fam., and his faith

Rather, we're here to give him advice so he can make the best choice for himself, faith or no faith.

[Forever Atlas]

well w/e... if thats how u interpreted his request okay. it would help us out if he said more. i understood that he was having doubts but i took from his statement he wanted help to not give up.

[dejah]

Originally Posted by Smooth

ok... well, i have different thoughts on the matters. so we will disagree. but lets not turn this into a debate. if we want to discuss those ideas, then make another thread. this one should focus back on the issue at hand to help our fellow man out here to not give up on his own self, his fam., and his faith. sorry to have started n e thing

i dont care whether you agree or disagree
just that you got the phrase wrong.

it's "God is Spirit" not "God is a Spirit"

which many people have mistaken it for and thus, get the wrong idea.