goldpanner

Oh right. remembered another thing that really made me think about Memories and memories like I do.
The fact that other people sharing his Memories meant his couldn't be restored properly. It seems to make more sense that it's because their own Memories were linked to the ones Namine replaced and delinked, seeing how it's basically just that - Memories exist in two Hearts. For Sora to forget something or remember it differently, the people the Memory/memory is shared with would have to too. But they remembered it well enough - as the original memory was there with the true Memories - just delinked and out of reach for Sora. For Namine to put it back into place however she needed to separate it, least the other people's chains would entangle it further.
It seems to work a lot less well to me with the 'make of Memory' theory.

your font still hurts my eyes.

Well, how do you know she didn't? The meteor shower memory for once. For all we know, Sora could've 'remembered' it after Kairi already reached the islands. That would be him remembering something after it actually happened.
Also, Namine said it herself -
To me, it always seemed more that the memories are there in their original form, albeit delinked. That is to say, she didn't snatch a Paopu from his memory and a white dress from this memory and the beach from this memory, but rewrote something new altogether. That is to say, the memory is new even by its Memory links. I'd sooner go with what Grace suggested being she painted over existing links in the chain as far as that is concerned, but that would contradict what Namine said as the memories were what she painted, not what was painted over.
Something else to point at that direction to me is actially Roxas. He was made to forget it all but he didn't. At the end he had his new, rewritten Memories and memories - as well as everything from his time in the Organization (sans Xion but I seriously doubt those came into play during KH2). So the more I think about it, the more I tend to disagree about there being true 'rewriting' of Memories.

Who said she didn't? There were new Memories there that were planted along with already existing memories and Memories. Then Sora remembered ONLY what Namine created in his Heart, but at the same time - he still had all of his Memories and memories. That's what really makes me believe that in Sora's Heart, the memories and Memories, both fake and real, existed at the same time. It's whether or not they were connected in a way his Heart could reach them that mattered. Because otherwise even that whole "remember Kairi plz" scene would be effectively making more mess inside Sora than good.

That really sounds awkward to me because as much as it would work with the system you're presenting, it means that one wooden sword is actually as many wooden swords as Sora got to even glance at one, but that hardly means one thing would lead to another and then another. If you go with the wrong Wooden Sword Memory, you could end up never getting back to what's connected to the other Wooden Sword Memories.

You say "chain" I see one long line. The chain you suggested would be that it branches - namely, not the first thing to come to mind for 'chain'.

Yes, and no. In a way they said exactly what she did. Only without "seeing" it, people try to read it in ways that might not have been intended :\ not saying it about you or me, but in general. I mean, if they didn't say AT ALL how it worked - why are you quoting Namine at me? XD

The thing with rewrite is that it can also mean replace.
If you already went into programming, I'll bring an example from that field which is one I'm good at.
Say you have a file. And the content for that file. And then you start writing new things over the file. Depending on your file system, file type, etc, the new content which supposedly should've been rewritten over the same place in the harddisk as the previous one - would actually get saved to a different location. You'd effectively have the two versions of the file on your hard drive, but only one you'd have "proper access" to, while the other would need you to restore it in one way or another.

Because I don't believe in SoKai, mostly. But also Namine's attitude. It was to save Sora, and so long as she was Sora's most important person, the Organization could use her as a tool. It was better for Sora for her to disappear out of his life, and with the Organization feeding her whatever about how she had to replace Kairi, she did what came naturally, and was everything she knew.

o.O yeah, said the person I rolled over and died over Xion. I'd sooner put that, aside from crappy horrible writing, to her being a PoH.

I'd sooner blame that on Namine putting herself in Kairi's social spot and the importance Sora gave those new memories XD;

Actually, the feelings were Namine oriented as whatever she might've based herself on, she said she was making whatever was there stronger. Hence why Kairi is only a friend as far as Sora is concerned but Namine is more than that - said by him. Light or no light.
Aside from that though, until they prove me right about Xion eating up Riku's Memories and hence his memory worlds were empty, then yes - Xion ate up those Memories, leaving Namine to make up new ones as she was running out of materials.

she's actually part of the motivation Namine would've had to force memories and Memories of Kairi back to Sora's chain. Because otherwise, so long as he kept forgetting her - Xion'd keep eating them up.

You're the one that raised the issue Namine could've been lying. She was guiding Sora away from her and to his real memories. Would be easier to have him work with her than against her, so she gave him a little coaxing.

I'd sooner write the novels off as non-canon until the games explain it like the novels did :\

x.x your font color looks bad.

My impression, mostly from that line you referenced later on - once you remember something, it leads to another, and then another. Like links in a chain. Now true. If you remember "wooden sword" it could remind Sora of both Riku and Tidus, but that's not how chains work upon your very first connotation.

I never implied that was how it worked with chronology. Just that it seems weird for me to see it like that. I know the memory would indicate which links the [yellow] Memory would relate to, but... eh. They never really bothered making it so difficult in the games. Especially if you throw in Namine's motif as a painter. Painters draw pictures. They create a story visually. They don't bother putting things together like scientists do.

Yeah, not the best point to use with me seeing my views on the matter :v especially with Xion making me think she had an even better reason to try and get Sora to hang onto his Memories of Kairi. Tying in with this, you have Sora not remembering a thing aside from Namine even after she pulled that silly charm performance. Namine is omnipotent ruler over Sora's Memories. I doubt he'd have remembered anything unless she let him, especially things he already couldn't. This wasn't "oh right, I forgot about it" - this was "it never happened" - especially for Kairi who didn't even get a figure on DI despite Namine being another girl (see Xion interference).

Bad similie as that would leave a scar and not how it used to be at first. But I get what you wanna say.

I really doubt the part about the Memories knowing how to put themselves back together. See again Sora not having a clue even after Namine pointed him in the right direction.
The thing is they never really implied anything of this "cooking" sort in the game. So while I do think there's Memory and memory, I don't think that a memory is made up of Memories in the way you describe it. One or more Memories would build up, say, the memory of their Promise, but it depends mostly on the length, not how many items and elements were involved.

I find it hard to see Memories in that sense so once you have the time and will, I'd like to see what brought you to believe Memories hold within them "objects" and "concepts" instead of "events". Especially as the whole metaphor of a "chain" doesn't really sit well with me in that aspect. You'd have to have the links entangled to for one Memory, and then how'd it link to another Memory? (er, I think I'm getting confused with the m and M but I hope you get my point)
It's true chains can have links tied to one another with more than two links being tied together. However, that isn't really how they described it in the game, especially with chronology - being the order of the links in the chain, seemingly having importance.
Then you have that arguably, Sora wouldn't have had enough "base" for Namine to draw all the Memories she'd want to from this.
And then we reach once again the issue of how to put it back together. If you have pages of a book that were scattered, by reading over all of them time and again you can eventually put together the original book by having the story make sense, and the pages tying to the pages that follow them and that they followed. However, if you have the "ingredients", I fail to see how Namine could've put them back together again without copies of the originals. This is what really makes me doubt any interpretation I ran into thus far other than that she made new Memories to paint the new memories over - it's all but impossible to put back, especially since we saw that once all the Memories were back, she managed to path Sora up in about a week (even without Kairi's intervention, it seems she wouldn't have needed another year).

Guess so.
Either way, sadly enough, this whole thing really made me take the novels with a grain of salt, especially joined with how little sense it makes to me that Namine can't create new memories :\

Good show, either way *offers hand in a shake*

I think making Xaldin hate on Xion to make us feel empathic for her (not that I minded much, I don't care for Xaldin XD) doesn't really have to relate to whether or not he knew. And it still seems to fit in better with me if he didn't, especially as it seems he was left out for most of the game.

Oh, I only looked at the Days novels, not those D: harumph.

Well, the games are the canon and terms must be come to. Or something. Grammar </3

I donno. If Xaldin really would've been in on it,

tl;dr I think that if Xaldin really would've been in the thick of things, we'd have known about it.

o_oa;
A real life Namine terrifies me.

:C yeah, but people told me about stuff they read about Castle Oblivion but on what you have in your LJ I didn't see it.

I need to hunt it down. Hang on *opens gamefaqs and youtube*
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tYeZzALLN7s
Yeah, he had no idea.

:\ hope the family thing works out.

"I know fully well that you only ever form an opinion/theory based on solid facts,"

Which brought along the monster Xion-Riku theory >_>;

"plus I'm not very smart and I don't know as much about KH canon as people like Grace Assassin"

>:C then he should stop arguing grammar. *bitter*

"Keep in mind that I am in the middle of the Days novel, which has a lot of CoM stuff in it, and yet I'm trying very hard to only use game canon--this is a bit confusing for me, but I am trying."

I'd love to read more but most of it is on Heartstation ._. *goes to your livejournal*

Gogogo.

In the Namine's powers thread. In the novels, Xaldin seems to know about the , but you don't get it in the least from the game. You think he was as surprised as the rest of them.

So, I think I found one contradiction between the novels and game already :X check it out if you haven't yet.