The Official Final Fantasy in Kingdom Hearts Discussion Thread

[Sir Jecht]

Originally Posted by Blade5468

No, they _arent_ especially popular, because AS YOU JUST SAID, people have been asking for Cloud and Vincent and Zack, and NOT Firion and Cloud of Darkness.

No, people don't ask for Cloud and crew, S-E shoves them down their throats and even the fans are getting sick of it. Which is why Nomura tried to add Vivi and Sezter, he failed but he acknowledged that not everyone is Kitase. Of course the FF's he made character designs for gets more priority since it's easier to work with but that doesn't mean that older FF fans won't get to see their favorite characters ruined in KH too.

I feel as they're pretty much TOO equal to put that much emphasis on FF7, you know?

When Tidus gets his own side story about his "darkness" then we'll talk about equality.

Besides, the game is by Nomura, let him give his own characters some glory, yeah?

Yeah because a movie, a remake of said movie, an OVA, a compilation of games and novels just isn't enough for the game that has everything. I'm talking FF7 here but I guess having made characters from the 3 top selling and most popular FF titles isn't enough either.

[Blade5468]

Originally Posted by Sir Jecht

No, people don't ask for Cloud and crew, S-E shoves them down their throats and even the fans are getting sick of it. Which is why Nomura tried to add Vivi and Sezter, he failed but he acknowledged that not everyone is Kitase. Of course the FF's he made character designs for gets more priority since it's easier to work with but that doesn't mean that older FF fans won't get to see their favorite characters ruined in KH too.

I don't know if you noticed, but people are obviously asking for Zack in BbS.

When Tidus gets his own side story about his "darkness" then we'll talk about equality.

Hey, FFX got everything FFVII did except a villain. They even had a cameo appearance in Olympus Colisseum, for fuck's sake, I'm sure that most people would prefer Cloud as a party member like Auron was, and look, FFX got that and FFVII didnt.

Yeah because a movie, a remake of said movie, an OVA, a compilation of games and novels just isn't enough for the game that has everything. I'm talking FF7 here but I guess having made characters from the 3 top selling and most popular FF titles isn't enough either.

And what you're saying is pretty much proof to the fact that they ARE widely considered the best of Final Fantasy and deserve the attention. Or at least that's one interpretation of reading what you said, you know, with all the sarcasm taken out.

Anyway, the game is by Tetsuya Nomura, adding his own characters is natural and blends better with the KH cast. The KH cast was made by him, FF7 was made by him. Cloud and Sora look like they came from the same game. Put Cecil's original design in KH and he suddenly looks like more of a knight in a shining armor than the Disney dudes.

[lycorismoon29]

Originally Posted by Blade5468

I don't know if you noticed, but people are obviously asking for Zack in BbS.

Doubt it will happen. Terra and Zack have a similar character structure. (Well...Pre-1st Class SOLDIER Zack) It would be almost like sticking in Reno when Axel is in the story.

Hey, FFX got everything FFVII did except a villain. They even had a cameo appearance in Olympus Colisseum, for fuck's sake, I'm sure that most people would prefer Cloud as a party member like Auron was, and look, FFX got that and FFVII didnt.

No. Cloud has been in a lot of stuff now. He was in Dissidia, KH1-2, that PS1 game that cameo'd Tifa, Seph, and Zack, that other game on the PSP that is a board game and has FF characters cameo'd in it...

FFVII can take a break.

And what you're saying is pretty much proof to the fact that they ARE widely considered the best of Final Fantasy and deserve the attention. Or at least that's one interpretation of reading what you said, you know, with all the sarcasm taken out.

FFVII is considered that only because it was the first FF game to be in 3D renders. (Then FF6 decided to do that as well and have CG scenes)

Anyway, the game is by Tetsuya Nomura, adding his own characters is natural and blends better with the KH cast. The KH cast was made by him, FF7 was made by him. Cloud and Sora look like they came from the same game. Put Cecil's original design in KH and he suddenly looks like more of a knight in a shining armor than the Disney dudes.

Nomura was only a character designer when FFVII first started. And Nomura did do the character design in Dissidia. Those characters could easily be slipped in since he "drew" them by your logic. And FFXIII characters...and Versus...and Agito...

[Shamdeo]

Originally Posted by Allister Rose

it's wishfull tihnking. tetsuya omura has inended to add only ff's characters he originally worked on. by kh2 he decided to expirement by adding more that he never made but still influenced some of his work

Stop talking. You're just bullshitting now. Everything you've said in your last half dozen posts is completely unfounded and/or incorrect.

[Sir Jecht]

Originally Posted by Blade5468

I don't know if you noticed, but people are obviously asking for Zack in BbS.

And they are asking for Jecht, Cyan, Kefka, WoL, Firion, etc. Nearly a majority of all FF characters have been suggested for KH, from Gligumesh to Mog not just Zack.

Hey, FFX got everything FFVII did except a villain. They even had a cameo appearance in Olympus Colisseum, for fuck's sake, I'm sure that most people would prefer Cloud as a party member like Auron was, and look, FFX got that and FFVII didnt.

I still see no mandatory side story with anyone from any of the FF's except Cloud, Tifa, and Sephy. FFX got a party member, fantastic. FFVIII has a character that is actually somewhat relevant to the overall plot, even better. FFVII has it's own separate storyline in the game, I feel that trumps a cameo and it has it's own series.

And what you're saying is pretty much proof to the fact that they ARE widely considered the best of Final Fantasy and deserve the attention. Or at least that's one interpretation of reading what you said, you know, with all the sarcasm taken out.

If it's already popular enough why does it need to be beaten like a dead horse? No one is saying take away all FF7, 8 and 10 characters just a nod for the FF's that brought them here.

Anyway, the game is by Tetsuya Nomura, adding his own characters is natural and blends better with the KH cast. The KH cast was made by him, FF7 was made by him. Cloud and Sora look like they came from the same game. Put Cecil's original design in KH and he suddenly looks like more of a knight in a shining armor than the Disney dudes.

So, instead of trying to do something different, KH should just be a cake walk when it comes to cameos? Nomu can draw the characters with his influence, he showed that in DISSIDIA.

[Blade5468]

[quote]I still see no mandatory side story with anyone from any of the FF's except Cloud, Tifa, and Sephy. FFX got a party member, fantastic. FFVIII has a character that is actually somewhat relevant to the overall plot, even better. FFVII has it's own separate storyline in the game, I feel that trumps a cameo and it has it's own series. [quote]

Sephiroth/Cloud are as relevant to the overall plot as TLS is, or the ice titan. They're relevant as a secret boss and his friend, nothing more.

If it's already popular enough why does it need to be beaten like a dead horse? No one is saying take away all FF7, 8 and 10 characters just a nod for the FF's that brought them here.

Tetsuya Nomura brought FF7, 8, and 10 to where they are, not the earlier games, seeing as 9 isnt riding the popularity wave, and oh look, TN didnt design that one.

So, instead of trying to do something different and KH should just be a cake walk when it comes to cameos? Nomu can draw the characters with his influence, he showed that in DISSIDIA.

Not enough difference, bro. Cecil still wouldnt fit with KH at all. I dont know why I'm using him as the example, but yeah, Cecil's Dissidia design wouldn't blend in with KH nearly as well as, say, Cloud or Squall, which blend in perfectly seeing as they're made by the SAME PERSON. Just redrawing the designs and adding the 'nomura touch' is not anywhere near enough to make the characters blend in with KH, they barely blend with EACH OTHER.

--------

Doubt it will happen. Terra and Zack have a similar character structure. (Well...Pre-1st Class SOLDIER Zack) It would be almost like sticking in Reno when Axel is in the story.

Surely it wouldn't be. Their personalities are completely different, the only thing that's similar is the hair, and that's a stretch, too. Anyway, I'm not saying its likely to happen, I'm just saying it's a pretty good idea and widely asked for, and fits well considering the game did so well on the same console just two years before.

No. Cloud has been in a lot of stuff now. He was in Dissidia, KH1-2, that PS1 game that cameo'd Tifa, Seph, and Zack, that other game on the PSP that is a board game and has FF characters cameo'd in it...

FFVII can take a break.

That just shows that he deserves it. Besides, read what I'm responding to, yeah? I didn't say he wasn't, and considering I'm a terrible ff7fag I probably know Cloud's cameos better than you do, I was just talking about KH.

FFVII is considered that only because it was the first FF game to be in 3D renders. (Then FF6 decided to do that as well and have CG scenes)

Terribly misguided :x
If that was the case, FF8 would quickly take its place as most popular, seeing as the graphics were so much incredibly better, same goes to FF9 and FF10. They each beat the one that came before it, and by a long shot. FF7 did the same, it's just that FF7 did it with a great plot and _a much better character designer_, and it was a better game overall. Of course, thats just my opinion.

Nomura was only a character designer when FFVII first started. And Nomura did do the character design in Dissidia. Those characters could easily be slipped in since he "drew" them by your logic. And FFXIII characters...and Versus...and Agito...

I dont remember denying that he was only a character designer when FF7 started.. what are you even getting at?
Yes, he did the character design in Dissidia, and no, Cecil does not look like a Nomura character, and no, Onion Knight would not under any condition blend in with the other Final Fantasy characters unless his armor's level of SHINY was taken down by 100%, same goes to Cecil, WoL, etc.
The pre-FF7 characters are too fantasy and knight-y to fit in with KH. KH is like a JRPG with kids that wear baggy clothes and other than wielding a weapon are pretty much normal every day dudes (or, well, magic too, but point stands, in looks at least.) Everything before Nomura, though, is knight in shining fucking armor.
Just because Nomura drew a picture of it doesn't mean it can fit in with an environment that it completely does not belong to. I don't know, I felt like the fantasy designs were forced in Dissidia, with the way the hair was all standing still in curls in the middle of the air, not even flowing.
Anyway, yes, FFXIII characters AND Versus AND Agito would probably come into play with KH in the future. I don't know if you can call him self absorbed or anything for it, but its HIS game, HE'S the director, he LETS other designers have their glory with characters like Vivi and Setzer, but its HIS game. Its only natural that HIS characters would fit in better, and that he would PREFER using his own characters. I mean, considering he worked with Square before becoming a designer, and that he obviously played the first six final fantasy games, he's probably a fan, but honestly, nothing fits his story better than his own characters.

[lycorismoon29]

Originally Posted by Blade5468

Surely it wouldn't be. Their personalities are completely different, the only thing that's similar is the hair, and that's a stretch, too. Anyway, I'm not saying its likely to happen, I'm just saying it's a pretty good idea and widely asked for, and fits well considering the game did so well on the same console just two years before.

Then it would feel like a FFVII overload. We already have Cloud, Sephiroth, Aerith, Yuffie, and Tifa. Then there is Axel who looks like Reno.

Terribly misguided :x
If that was the case, FF8 would quickly take its place as most popular, seeing as the graphics were so much incredibly better, same goes to FF9 and FF10. They each beat the one that came before it, and by a long shot. FF7 did the same, it's just that FF7 did it with a great plot and _a much better character designer_, and it was a better game overall. Of course, thats just my opinion.

Psh...FFVII was good but not great.

I dont remember denying that he was only a character designer when FF7 started.. what are you even getting at?
Yes, he did the character design in Dissidia, and no, Cecil does not look like a Nomura character, and no, Onion Knight would not under any condition blend in with the other Final Fantasy characters unless his armor's level of SHINY was taken down by 100%, same goes to Cecil, WoL, etc.
The pre-FF7 characters are too fantasy and knight-y to fit in with KH. KH is like a JRPG with kids that wear baggy clothes and other than wielding a weapon are pretty much normal every day dudes (or, well, magic too, but point stands, in looks at least.) Everything before Nomura, though, is knight in shining fucking armor.
Just because Nomura drew a picture of it doesn't mean it can fit in with an environment that it completely does not belong to. I don't know, I felt like the fantasy designs were forced in Dissidia, with the way the hair was all standing still in curls in the middle of the air, not even flowing.
Anyway, yes, FFXIII characters AND Versus AND Agito would probably come into play with KH in the future. I don't know if you can call him self absorbed or anything for it, but its HIS game, HE'S the director, he LETS other designers have their glory with characters like Vivi and Setzer, but its HIS game. Its only natural that HIS characters would fit in better, and that he would PREFER using his own characters. I mean, considering he worked with Square before becoming a designer, and that he obviously played the first six final fantasy games, he's probably a fan, but honestly, nothing fits his story better than his own characters.

this statement completely contradicts your last statement then. You said that he drew Cloud and Sora and the FFX characters which is why they ft in. But then he also drew Dissidia art as well which would fit in yoru statement that characters he drew can fit in. And the characters style can be toned down if they are put in KH. They don't have to wear all armor. They don't even have to be the same age as they were in their respective game. Squall was made ten years older than his game counterpart. Tidus was made like four years younger than his. Yuna, Paine, and Rikku were made into pixies/faeries.

Actually I doubt FFXIII/VersusXIII Agito characters will get in to KH.

And wow...you sound very passionate about Nomura. Chillax.

[Blade5468]

Originally Posted by lycorismoon29

Then it would feel like a FFVII overload. We already have Cloud, Sephiroth, Aerith, Yuffie, and Tifa. Then there is Axel who looks like Reno.

And cid, but yeah.

Psh...FFVII was good but not great.

That says "opinion," on there, you know, the thing that belongs to a person and can be as absolutely illogical as it wants?

this statement completely contradicts your last statement then. You said that he drew Cloud and Sora and the FFX characters which is why they ft in. But then he also drew Dissidia art as well which would fit in yoru statement that characters he drew can fit in. And the characters style can be toned down if they are put in KH. They don't have to wear all armor. They don't even have to be the same age as they were in their respective game. Squall was made ten years older than his game counterpart. Tidus was made like four years younger than his. Yuna, Paine, and Rikku were made into pixies/faeries.

Surely if he was just going to change them into looking like Nomura characters then he should have just used Nomura characters to begin with?

Actually I doubt FFXIII/VersusXIII Agito characters will get in to KH.

Oh don't worry :/ they will. I'm not going to argue about that, though. Versus IS extremely likely, you know, seeing as its the only other game with the same director.

And wow...you sound very passionate about Nomura. Chillax.

I'm not at all passionate. I'm just using logic. It's his game, and he's a much better designer according to my opinion, and apparently Square Enix's opinion as well. Of course if you like the fantasy little hair flowing in wind and guys looking like chicks thing that the other guy (whose name escapes me) does, thats cool. I personally dont, so I'm completely okay with this.
It's just logic, though, that there will barely be any non-nomura characters in the future.
And, lol, I don't remember saying I wasn't relaxed or implying it in any way. It's just an argument on a forum, there's no reason to be mad or "unrelaxed," you're just trying to prove the other person wrong, insulting is absolutely pointless.

[YPPQ510]

....really? NOBODY HAS SAID CHOCOBOS YET? (they could have im just too lazy to look lol) it could be real cool, like have SDG or TAV turn into chocobos and fight alongside chocobos to defeat a evil heartless/unverse chocobo. just think out loud.

[Shamdeo]

Originally Posted by Blade5468

Tetsuya Nomura brought FF7, 8, and 10 to where they are, not the earlier games, seeing as 9 isnt riding the popularity wave, and oh look, TN didnt design that one.

So by way of character design, he claims full benefit of the games' success?

[Igshar]

Originally Posted by Shamdeo

So by way of character design, he claims full benefit of the games' success?

Of course. It has nothing to do with anything else, because Tetsuya Nomura is a genius.

And your avatar is to avatars as longcat is to normal cats.

[lycorismoon29]

Originally Posted by Blade5468

And cid, but yeah.

I don't count Cid since I don't tire of his dialogue and the fact he isn't even there anyways. You see him once or twice and that is it. I actually want his role as gummi ship parts guy to return.

That says "opinion," on there, you know, the thing that belongs to a person and can be as absolutely illogical as it wants?

Yeah. And I gave my opinion as well. FFVII was good. Not great. And your opinion was it was great. I wasn't debunking it or anything.

Surely if he was just going to change them into looking like Nomura characters then he should have just used Nomura characters to begin with?

So was he going to make new characters for a game that was suppose to have FF1-FF10 characters? "DISSIDIA: Final Fantasy! The game where you don't play as your favorite heroes on the side of Cosmos or favorite villains on the side of Chaos to decide the fate of the universe! (this does not include Cloud, Sephiroth, Squall, Ultimecia, Tidus, or Jecht (and possibly Terra and Kefka since he worked on FFVI!))"

No. That would retarded.

Oh don't worry :/ they will. I'm not going to argue about that, though. Versus IS extremely likely, you know, seeing as its the only other game with the same director.

I actually find it less than likely seeing as the game will still be a new game when a new KH comes out.

I'm not at all passionate. I'm just using logic. It's his game, and he's a much better designer according to my opinion, and apparently Square Enix's opinion as well. Of course if you like the fantasy little hair flowing in wind and guys looking like chicks thing that the other guy (whose name escapes me) does, thats cool. I personally dont, so I'm completely okay with this.
It's just logic, though, that there will barely be any non-nomura characters in the future.
And, lol, I don't remember saying I wasn't relaxed or implying it in any way. It's just an argument on a forum, there's no reason to be mad or "unrelaxed," you're just trying to prove the other person wrong, insulting is absolutely pointless.

When did I insult?

[Axelea]

Hey I thinking today about what cameos could happen in BBS. I didn't read to see if my idea was posted in this thread earlier so sorry if it was stated already. Since we know that Deep Space is basically going to have the experiments like stich and that yellow fellow ( had to say it ) , do you think it's possible that maybe Red XIII might make an appearance? Since he was an experiment of Hojos in FF7? I know most of the FF7 characters are supposed to be in Hollow Bastion but do you think its possible? aha just for the record I'm tired of ff7 characters aswell so don't flame me XD

[∞]

Originally Posted by Allister Rose

i dont see why gilgamesh is so popular.

Because he's the mother of all warriors. Well not mother, but you get the expression.

[The 14th Order]

WARNING: Possible spoilers. Don't QQ to me, I warned you.


Technically...
It's a first appearence, with BBS taking place 10 years before KH1

Okay, here I'd like to make a legitamite thread discussing/theorizing on worlds that will be introduced/"brought back" in BBS.

I'll start off by saying.....

Neverland

for the following reason:
When Tinkerbell recognizes Roxas in Days

Now, we can easily say "BUT SORA VISITED NEVERLAND AND HE LOOK LIKE ROXAS SO SHE MIXED THEM UP LOLOLOL"

True. Sora did visit Neverland in KH1... and Days did take place inbetween KH1 and 2, so you can easily say that she recognizes Roxas from Sora.

However, Roxas is the spitting image of Ven. Sora and Ven look different enough to be identified as two separate people.

So, it is fair to say that perhaps Ven visits Neverland in BBS, and that would be how Tink recognizes Roxas in Days, from a possible visit from Ven in BBS.

Plausibe, no? If not, feel free to correct me.



Some other plausibe worlds that could be in BBS:

The Black Cauldron
-This is a fine world that could be introduced into the KH series.
Plot Summary for those of you who are clueless as to what this movie is:

Disney's 25th full-length animated classic, THE BLACK CAULDRON, fills the screen with magic and wonder. This fun-filled tale of heroism overflows with colorful characters, trailblazing animation, and nonstop action. In the mystical land of Prydain, Taran, a young boy who dreams of a future as an invincible warrior, finds himself leading a real-life quest. In a race against the evil Horned King, Taran must be the first to find the mysterious Black Cauldron or the Horned King will unleash its power and take over the world. With the help of a magic sword, an enchanting princess, an adorable clairvoyant pig, and a furry little creature named Gurgi, Taran overcomes winged dragons, the King's monstrous henchmen, three batty witches, and more -- and learns nothing is as powerful as courage and friendship.

Mmmmm... It sure does have that "kid becoming the hero, defeating the bad guy, saving the world" formula. Tell me that wouldn't fit in.

Treasure Planet
- Ah, Treasure Planet. A treasure hunt across the universe. With all the steampunk-esque technology, like Jim's hover-sail board, I think it would prove to be quite an exciting world. Plus it's got that "meaning of friendship" lesson that seems to stick with KH quite a bit. It might be tedious, considering there are multiple planets within the "universe" of Treasure Planet, but I still think it could be done. Note: The same directors who directed Alladin and Little Mermaid, directed TP. It would be easy to make the characters not stand out that much from BBS to the point where they wouldn't fit. (IMO)

The Emperor's New Groove: Could help Kuzco regain his title as emperor and fight off Ysma and her royal guards. I'm sure they could come up with some other bosses. Like the Unversed threat appearing.

Hunchback of Notre Dame: I like the thought of this being in KH at some point. The idea seems fitting.

Halloween Town: Has been in the rest of them. Why not BBS?

Toy Story: Pixar Schmixar, Toy Story would be bad ass.

The Sword and the Stone: it has that kid becomes hero theme. Mideval setting = win.

Mulan/Land of Dragons: Would be interesting to see again. Land of Depature and Eraqus give me an imperial china vibe. Mulan would fit pretty good in there.


Did I miss any? What are your ideas on worlds that could be in BBS?