KH3 players

[Deep-Wonder]

I highly doubt that Kairi will become an antagonist. She serves as a symbol. Although it's a western archetype, Kairi functions somewhat as a symbol of innocence and purity. She may be hurt or corrupted to show the fleeting nature of such qualities, but it doesn't seem correct to make her turn against Riku.

Her attitude towards Riku isn't really hate or dislike. It's more like, "Hey, thanks for going through all that shit and ruining your life to save me like three times, but I like Sora."

[Smile]

Originally Posted by DeepWonder

Kairi can be seen as a plot device more than a character.

True enough.

She is largely Sora's motivation

Hardly. If she's not paired up with Riku in the "find Riku and Kairi", she's a secondary objective that showed up along the way.
KH1 - along with Riku.
CoM - nonexistent.
KH2 - motivation only when the people Sora already wanted to beat up kidnapped her, adding only one more reason for him to beat them up over.
Small wonder I mock SoKai so much when Kairi doesn't really come off as that special to him?

and the cause of some tension between him and Riku.

KH1 Traverse Town shows that the source of tension between him and Riku was Sora befriending Donald and Goofy, and Maleficent played on his jealousy for Sora. Kairi was a means to an end for Riku to try and hurt Sora back.
It was more - Kairi is Sora's friend so he asked Riku about her, thus making Riku jealous for Sora.
It's... not really what they were aiming at, I'd say, seeing how Riku should care about Kairi for Kairi, not because saving her was a contest between him and Sora.

Her role as a princess of heart in the KH universe also makes her difficult to relate to.

Not really. Belle in KH2 was really easy to relate to, and she was a PoH. It's Kairi that makes Kairi difficult to relate to.

And who knows, Kairi might surprise us.

Yes. So far she kept disappointing me worse in every game she appeared in, and required a Nobody and now - a lookalike that might yes end up being related to her to even truly properly base her plot relevance post-KH1.
:\ gah.

The ending of KH2, where they open the letter from King Mickey (presumably), shows them reading it together. This, to me, seems to send a message that Sora's friends will be more directly involved in KH3.

I wouldn't put that much importance in that scene. It was put in there because Disney was afraid people'd think there'd be no sequel.
As to Kairi being a part of it, I doubt Sora and Riku'd let her come. They both know that unless they absolutely have to, they're better off leaving her behind, for her own good.

Originally Posted by DeepWonder

I highly doubt that Kairi will become an antagonist. She serves as a symbol. Although it's a western archetype, Kairi functions somewhat as a symbol of innocence and purity. She may be hurt or corrupted to show the fleeting nature of such qualities, but it doesn't seem correct to make her turn against Riku.

You're forgetting the people behind KH are Japanese, however. And it's hardly an uncommon concept where one is so righteous he turns evil for the sake of an ideal. An example I abuse and for the lack of a better comparison bring from anime - the X-Laws in Shaman King.
No one can argue the person they're hunting is evil, but their methods make them even worse off than him.
The Darkness makes people inhumane. They can't help their acts.
The Light would make people forget that Darkness affects human beings and thus they'll turn truly evil.
I doubt they'll go there because it's a Disney game, but it's not that unthinkable on a theoretical level. In fact, with Darkness and Nothingness dealt with, what's missing now is to give the Light proper basis.
And Sora's "maybe the Darkness got to me too" quote might just be foreshadowing that he too will be at risk, hence putting him between Riku and Kairi as the two fight, symbolising Darkness and Light, in roles they supposedly shouldn't be playing.

Her attitude towards Riku isn't really hate or dislike. It's more like, "Hey, thanks for going through all that shit and ruining your life to save me like three times, but I like Sora."

In KH2. In KH1 it was a lot more active, which comes from them actually trying to do something with her instead of simply have her as a Mary Sue.

[Deep-Wonder]

Riku and Sora may consider bringing her so that they can protect her. Sora may simply not want to be apart from her.

You are right about Belle. She was a fine character. Perhaps being a PoH isn't as constrictive as I thought.

I do think, however, that Riku and Sora still young boys and it simply makes sense that Kairi be the cause of some tension between them. Of course, their friendship trumps any jealousy that exists. This is more relevant in the first game, though. Riku is more mature now, and simply wants her to be happy rather than happy with him.

Enough of that though. Due to the events in KH2 and all three having seen a lot, I think there is a chance that Riku and/or Kairi will become party members at some point in the game. Hopefully, Kairi will become a more rounded character. This will also allow Sora to be more likable, although he's already won us over.

I am a little sick of Kairi being a briefcase. Unfortunately, by nature, she is the shortest way to Sora's heart for the antagonists. It's an age-old concept. I hope KH3 doesn't rely on it so much.

[Shadow Fenix]

No, by the time KHIII even comes out, if it even does, it'll just be Sora. Nomura mentioned the next game after these will have Sora as main (or something along those lines)

[Smile]

Originally Posted by DeepWonder

Riku and Sora may consider bringing her so that they can protect her.

It would mean they learned something from past experiences. Namely, Axel kidnapping Kairi from DI. But between that and bringing her along as a party member, there's a long way to go.

Sora may simply not want to be apart from her.

If you believe in SoKai :\

You are right about Belle. She was a fine character. Perhaps being a PoH isn't as constrictive as I thought.

No one ever said it was. The PoHs as a whole, Kairi included, were just eternally plot devices, so people just jumped to conclusions about their personalities and traits. The only thing that was ever said that affected people was Darkness. The PoHs lack Darkness. Hence, they lose that as an excuse for their behavior. That's about everything we can conclude about them at this time, until the Light is established as a personality 'shaper'.

I do think, however, that Riku and Sora still young boys and it simply makes sense that Kairi be the cause of some tension between them. Of course, their friendship trumps any jealousy that exists. This is more relevant in the first game, though. Riku is more mature now, and simply wants her to be happy rather than happy with him.

Only there's barely anything implying they really are friends beyond what being Sora's friends forces out of them. Both had more than enough motivation to go out on the cruise without regarding each other.

Enough of that though. Due to the events in KH2 and all three having seen a lot, I think there is a chance that Riku and/or Kairi will become party members at some point in the game.

Riku'll either be a party member or go off on his own. In which case I hope he'll get his own scenario or something.
Kairi's the unlikely one here.

Hopefully, Kairi will become a more rounded character.

Unrelated to whether or not she comes along :\ even if she came along, if they won't develop her, we're back to square one. They need to do something with her, which they haven't thus far.

This will also allow Sora to be more likable, although he's already won us over.

True that. Scenes like KH2's Halloween Town show just how much Sora too suffers from being forced this supposed relationship on him. I'd much rather they have put in something in retrospective like they did for Sora and Riku with Santa than that :\
Base them being friends before romance, dammit.

I am a little sick of Kairi being a briefcase. Unfortunately, by nature, she is the shortest way to Sora's heart for the antagonists. It's an age-old concept. I hope KH3 doesn't rely on it so much.

It's kind of misguided, actually. Though in the Organization's defense let it be said they did know what was up with Namine in CoM, so they knew that if Sora cared specifically about Kairi beyond the "he went to save her in KH1 so it must mean something", it was thanks to Namine basing the feelings for her, and then claiming they moved on to Kairi.

But then we turn back to the fact that KH2 sucks so time will tell how much of that will be reused. :\

[Deep-Wonder]

I do agree that the series should do more to actually show them being friends and emotionally depending on each other in normal, not-the-end-of-the-world ways. I guess we're past that though. We just have to accept it. They're friends.

I'm not really arguing that Kairi has to be a party member in the literal sense. I suppose I got off topic, I'm mainly discussing her merits as a character and how she can be further developed. I think she'll be around in the next game. Not sitting in a bad guy's chamber or something. At least I hope.

My desire to see her fight probably stems from my dissatisfaction with the lack of strong female protagonists in the game. Maleficent is badass, in my opinion. But she's Disney, and as good as they are, they're not deep and complicated. Luckily we have Aqua, although it's uncertain what the hell she actually does.

Mainly, I think Kairi fighting would help win over some of her critics. If they can manage to do it without looking ridiculous, why not?

I haven't been here long. Did you dislike KH2?

[Smile]

Originally Posted by DeepWonder

We just have to accept it. They're friends.

They did a far better job basing Namine as Sora's childhood friend than they did Kairi, and that was fake. Riku had Sora actually going through stuff and downright say Riku's his best friend, and the plethora of flashback bits they added in the first FM.
:\ Kairi further fails. Meh.

My desire to see her fight probably stems from my dissatisfaction with the lack of strong female protagonists in the game. Maleficent is badass, in my opinion. But she's Disney, and as good as they are, they're not deep and complicated. Luckily we have Aqua, although it's uncertain what the hell she actually does.

Strong =\= able to fight. Namine was magnificent. Xion's fighting skills are debatable but she already shows more promise than Kairi. It's what they do with a character aside from the fighting that counts.
And I agree about Aqua, she's promising as well.

Mainly, I think Kairi fighting would help win over some of her critics. If they can manage to do it without looking ridiculous, why not?

If, being the operative word. The thing is, like I said before, they'd be admitting they failed with her thus far. It's not winning over some of her critics, it's admitting we were right and now they'll try to fix it, probably be rewriting her character.

I haven't been here long. Did you dislike KH2?

Welcome to KHI.

[Deep-Wonder]

Somehow I completely forgot about Namine, which is odd, because I truly enjoyed ReCoM. I don't know enough about Xion to adequately judge her, I have been more excited about BBS than Days.

I don't think it's a matter of rewriting the character, but rather improving her and diving deeper. I think some scenes of SRK's childhood friendship (a possibility with BBS) can help define them and their relationships better.

Her absence in ReCoM actually helped earn her sympathy, I think. Despite her name rarely being spoken for most of the game, she is a lingering presence. The final scene was poignant and heartfelt. I thought that was very good and made me think that KH2 would realize Kairi's importance and focus on her character. Turns out, no. So, hopefully this will be accomplished in a future game.

[Memory Master]

Here is my opinion on Kairi:

KH1: She was important to the plot and I did'nt have much of a problem with her.
COM: Namine had a much better role than Kairi and I like Sonami more than Sokai. (Personaly Namine falls into the group of girls I prefer. Kairi is just not my type.)
KH2: Kairi was a dissapointment in this game.

Kairi was a bitch to Riku. Honestly he has gone through hell for her and yet she chooses Sora over Riku. Riku deserves so much more compasion and respect from his friends than what he gets.

This is why I hope Aqua and Terra will be the couple in BBS, because Aqua ad Ven would suggest Sora and Kairi.

In conclusion, I hope that Kairi's character is developed more and she becomes more like Namine.

[Smile]

Originally Posted by DeepWonder

I don't think it's a matter of rewriting the character, but rather improving her and diving deeper. I think some scenes of SRK's childhood friendship (a possibility with BBS) can help define them and their relationships better.

The thing is, if you end up basing their friendships, you'd get into a lot of trouble explaining a lot of mistreatment between her and Riku. Unless of course the Light and Darkness struggle is brought into play.

Her absence in ReCoM actually helped earn her sympathy, I think.

Not really. I admit, part of why I love Namine that much is because of the blunt contrast between her and Kairi. Kairi not being there and them investing so much in Namine's relationships with both Sora and Riku via Repliku really showed how flawed Kairi was as a character. This wasn't sympathy, this was me pitying her for being so badly written in KH1.

Despite her name rarely being spoken for most of the game, she is a lingering presence.

Because Namine made her one. Never forget that. Sora certainly did.

The final scene was poignant and heartfelt. I thought that was very good and made me think that KH2 would realize Kairi's importance and focus on her character. Turns out, no. So, hopefully this will be accomplished in a future game.

Kairi's importance in CoM was brought along by Namine, who was trying to get Sora to stop obsessing over her. Kairi was a good means-to-an-end. That's her true importance in the series.

Hence why if they do turn her into an active party member, they'll have to really work hard to explain how she ended up being an Aqua or a Xion all of a sudden.

[3-D]

i think we're focusing too much on Kairi here

i actually like Kairi, its those other rwo that get on my nerves
/sarcasm
but seriously Sora, and Riku have their flaws too

[Deep-Wonder]

Well, Kairi is the more controversial character. Some have very negative feelings towards her, which is fine. I personally like her through the transitive property. Any friend of Sora is a friend of mine.

Certainly, no one is perfect. Kairi has been treated differently than the rest. Rain and I are simply discussing her role in the series and how and if she can be improved.

Me and my friends always joked that Riku's jealously towards Sora in KH1 mainly stemmed from Keyblade envy.

[DestinyKid]

Originally Posted by Oblivion fenrir

She did remember? In KH2!

Yes, fianlly someone who knows, Yes!! Not alone here anymore!

Originally Posted by DeepWonder

Riku and Sora may consider bringing her so that they can protect her. Sora may simply not want to be apart from her.

You are right about Belle. She was a fine character. Perhaps being a PoH isn't as constrictive as I thought.

I do think, however, that Riku and Sora still young boys and it simply makes sense that Kairi be the cause of some tension between them. Of course, their friendship trumps any jealousy that exists. This is more relevant in the first game, though. Riku is more mature now, and simply wants her to be happy rather than happy with him.

Enough of that though. Due to the events in KH2 and all three having seen a lot, I think there is a chance that Riku and/or Kairi will become party members at some point in the game. Hopefully, Kairi will become a more rounded character. This will also allow Sora to be more likable, although he's already won us over.

I am a little sick of Kairi being a briefcase. Unfortunately, by nature, she is the shortest way to Sora's heart for the antagonists. It's an age-old concept. I hope KH3 doesn't rely on it so much.

Sora and Kairi promised Roxas and Namine that they would be together so that they too can be together!

Originally Posted by Rain

They did a far better job basing Namine as Sora's childhood friend than they did Kairi, and that was fake. Riku had Sora actually going through stuff and downright say Riku's his best friend, and the plethora of flashback bits they added in the first FM.
:\ Kairi further fails. Meh.



Strong =\= able to fight. Namine was magnificent. Xion's fighting skills are debatable but she already shows more promise than Kairi. It's what they do with a character aside from the fighting that counts.
And I agree about Aqua, she's promising as well.



If, being the operative word. The thing is, like I said before, they'd be admitting they failed with her thus far. It's not winning over some of her critics, it's admitting we were right and now they'll try to fix it, probably be rewriting her character.



Welcome to KHI.

LOL!! Yep this is funny, but stupid at the same time

[Smile]

Originally Posted by DestinyKid

Yes, fianlly someone who knows, Yes!! Not alone here anymore!

:\ but it's not hers. It's Riku's.

Sora and Kairi promised Roxas and Namine that they would be together so that they too can be together!

..."together" was never an issue. Sora and Kairi promised they'd see each other every day. Which is, surprise surprise, they've been doing for all their lives, being childhood friends >.>;;; it doesn't mean anything too much.
And some value that promise had, when Sora agreed to stay with Riku in the Darkness :\

And stop multi posting, dammit. You do it again, and I won't be so forgiving. You've been warned in the past.

[~azure.requiem]

Originally Posted by FFKH-follower

dose any1 think sqaure will keep useing the 3 character story line thing like in BBS for KH3, you know where you get to use Sora, Rikku, and Kairi?

also if this question has already been asked, im sorry

~ yeah. they've been doin' that since their square soft days. i mean, nomura did creat three more characters to be the main characters for bbs.